405 FWD Bilge Breaker

[Serendipity]

So I wasn't able to find a solution in the post I searched.
Hopefully my 405 and 406 buddies can assist.

I replaced all 3 bilges, both bilge blowers and the float switches 2 months ago. Unfortunately, I thought going with a bigger pump was better not understanding the electrical side based on some of the post I read.

So I replaced all my 1500gph Rule Bilges with 2000gph Rule Bilges. Could something this small make my fwd breaker throw?

So here is my problem. The fwd bilge will not empty without throwing the red breaker under the bottom stair and the top black breaker above the dining table in the galley. I must manually turn the fwd switch on at the helm, then reset both switches numerous times to get the water to drain. Once the water gets down where you can hear the sucking noise. The breaker quits tripping and will finish emptying the water.

I really dont know where to start on this one.

Thanks

[km1125]

Yes, it's possible that under a load (while the pump is pumping) that the pump current draw is exceeding the breaker spec. Depending on the wire size, you may just need to step up the breaker size to the appropriate size for the 2000GPH pump. Somewhere in the pump literature it should specify the recommended breaker size. You may have to pull the breaker out to find out what size is on the label on the side, if your wiring diagram doesn't list it.

EDIT: Just quickly checked out the rule site for specs. I DON'T KNOW THIS IS THE PUMP YOU ARE USING, so it's just an example.

In the chart below, the 1500 draws 7 amps and recommends a 9 amp fuse. The 2000 draws 12 amps and recommends a 15 amp fuse. So if you put the 2000 in place of this 1500, then the 12 amp draw WOULD blow the 9 amp fuse on a regular basis.

Check your wire size to see if you can move up to a larger breaker.

rule_pumps.jpg

[g36]

Reviewing my 405 manual all 3 bilge pumps all have 7.5a breakers and run with #10 wire. I havent had a need to eyeball this ive had no issues with oem pumps so you need verify this info. As stated above verify the wire and if #10 a increase to a correct breaker size would keep it from tripping

[bud37]

At this point your forward pump is useless unless someone is there to play with it.....are the other pumps you changed out the same or just the forward ?
Step one , find out where all the water is coming from.....change pump back to 1500 for the time being until you can correct the water influx and wiring upgrade, that way your boat will be safe when you are not there.

[km1125]

Source of the post Reviewing my 405 manual all 3 bilge pumps all have 7.5a breakers and run with #10 wire. I havent had a need to eyeball this ive had no issues with oem pumps so you need verify this info. As stated above verify the wire and if #10 a increase to a correct breaker size would keep it from tripping

Wow. If it's 10ga that should have been obvious when they spliced in the wires at the pump, as they'd be splicing an 18 or 16ga wire into a 10. If that is the case, then get new breakers ordered and installed and you'll be all set!

[tomschauer]

I believe you have a wiring issues, not a breaker issue. You should only have one breaker feeding the pump. If it runs in manual after the float switch drops without tripping the breaker, I would start there. Sounds like someone crossed two circuits.

[g36]

Actually a carver 405 and probably others has a seperate breakers for the auto and manual circuits on the pumps. Both are 7.5a and #10 wire per manual pg 33 on the 12v systems. The breaker under the step is wired from battery selector position 1 for the auto circuits. One for each of the 3 pumps The panel breakers again one for each of the 3 pumps is for manual mode. I have these on my 405 in these locations .Imo the reason it's tripping is pump is pulling too many amps when pumping water and then when low water and sucking air the load on the pump is less and will run without tripping the breaker. Again I am just looking in the schematic without visually checking these statements but it makes since from what your saying

[Serendipity]

You guys are the bomb and thanks so much for the insight.
I will update when I get it figured out though

[g36]

One thing to note about the wire size run to the pump is to make sure you have pushed back into the wire loom and see if there are splices there because if you just cut the wire at the pump and install the new pump you may only see the small guage wire and not what is the run of #10 because it's tucked back in the plastic wire loom

[km1125]

Source of the post Actually a carver 405 and probably others has a seperate breakers for the auto and manual circuits on the pumps.

My older 3607 is setup the same way. Two breakers for each pump. They are both in the main panel, but one set is fed directly from the #1 post on the battery switch and the other is fed from the main DC panel. This also means the auto is fed from the #1 engine battery (regardless of switch position) but the manual is fed from the house battery.